Leading with Heart: How to Build Trust and Make an Impact with LA Tribune's Karen Hall

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Welcome to the A World of Difference podcast. I'm Lori Adams-Brown, and this is a podcast for those who are different and want to make a difference. All right, listen up, because this can change your life. If you've been feeling overwhelmed, stuck, or just not yourself lately, I need you to hear this. You don't have to go through it alone.

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You deserve to feel better. So don't wait. Go to www.betterhelp.com difference and take that first step for your healing today. Welcome back to A World of Difference. Today we've got an absolute powerhouse in the house, someone who's all about leading with heart, building trust, and making a real impact.

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Meet Karen Hall, AKA the Queen of Empathy. She's a mom, a wife, a grandma, and a woman of faith who's been changing the game as an executive producer, host and speaker with the Los Angeles Tribune. But that's not all. She's a podcast host of multiple podcasts. And Karen is also an Emotional Intelligence leadership coach, helping leaders level up by strengthening relationships and building trust through emotional intelligence.

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If you're ready to stop playing small and start leading with more authenticity, compassion and confidence, then this episode is for you. Let's dive in.

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Hello, Karen. Welcome to A World of Difference podcast. It's great to see you. Hello, Lori. It's great to see you again.

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I always love to see you. It's so fun because we met in la, which is, you know, you don't live in la, but your role is related to it. And so, but I. The moment we had just had such connection after I spoke at this conference. We're both podcasters and met at Podcast Movement Evolutions la.

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Shout out to any listeners who are also podcasters who were there or who read the current one. But you came up to me afterwards, and we just had so many things in common and such a connection. And so was really excited that we finally worked it out for you to be on the podcast. And I'm wondering, today is a very special day, and we're recording this, but it won't be released today. But just to get to know you a little bit better, talk about today and why it's so special to you and how it's inspired you.

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So today is the celebration of Purim. And this is a celebration for the Jewish people who mark the day when Esther in. For all of you who are familiar with the Bible, Esther went before the king. And so she was married to the king, but she was not allowed to go to him without being invited. So she risked her life because anybody who went in could be killed without that invitation.

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And the reason that she went in was because the king had an advisor that was evil. And the king didn't know, but he was planning to have all the Jews annihilated In over about 137 countries or so in Persia at that time. So all of the Jewish people were praying and fasting for Esther. And so she went before the king to tell him about this evil plot and to please spare the Jewish people. And he agreed.

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He found out the truth, and he made sure that the Jewish people were redeemed and rescued and they were all saved. And so to this day, this is a very special celebration of parties and big festivities that go on. I happen to love the Jewish people. I love Israel, and I feel such a connection with them. I am now the vice president of Society with 90210 Enterprises, and I am working very closely with the Jewish people there.

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And I am also an executive producer with the Los Angeles Tribune, where we also have numerous people that we are connected with that celebrate Purim. And so I just wanted to say, because Esther has been such a role model in my life to have courage and to be a woman of integrity and the power of prayer, to have so many people praying and fasting and have this incredible miracle that she was able to be a part of. One of my favorite scriptures is when she is told, who knows? But such a time as this, you know, that you have come forth for this purpose. And I often think about that.

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What is our divine purpose that we are fulfilling? And do we have the courage to step up and do that? So I love prayer. So amazing. We're recording this in Women's History Month, and I just Think stories of women like Esther and others who've been inspired by her over the years and generations to do the right thing at the right time is not going out of style anytime soon, considering the geopolitical situation we find ourselves in.

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You know, when it came to just things like getting the right to vote, women here in the United States and in the UK and all kinds of places, you know, receive not only verbal threats, but physical threats, incarcerations. Being willing to risk our lives for the right thing at the right time is something we draw inspiration from Esther and others for. And I think that when it comes to leading an authentic leadership that, you know, we can't just think about ourselves. Leadership in its core means we are concerned about others. And so, you know, as you lead, as you podcast, as you're at LA Tribune and you're doing all the things that you just mentioned, I would love for you to talk about emotional intelligence as it relates to leadership.

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Why is that important for us to have emotional intelligence? And why are you so passionate about it? Yes, thank you for asking. I am very passionate about emotional intelligence. One reason why is because it's been the journey of a lifetime for me as I have worked to learn how to regulate my own nervous system.

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That's been very challenging. When my emotions would get escalated, I couldn't figure out how to. People would say, well, just get over it. Just let it go. And I'm like, that feels like twitching my ears.

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I have no idea what you're talking about. And so I had to work personally on that. I honestly have worked on it my whole life, and I have found that as I have learned actual tools and mindset shifts and received coaching and honestly healed from some of the trauma in my life that has enabled me to be able to regulate my emotions. And as a leader, we are the ones that people call on in the moment of crisis. Who do we look to?

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We look to that leader. I think about how powerful my energy is as a leader, and if I'm agitated, if I'm stressed, well, the people that are influenced by me also feel that energy and it affects their nervous system. But on the contrast, if I am calm, if I am centered, if I have been able to calm my nervous system, then I can be a calming influence over everyone as well. I can convey confidence. Even if the situation is such that I don't have an answer, I can still convey confidence that I believe that we will find it out.

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Now, I believe very much in authenticity. So I don't. I don't want to Misconstrue this, that, oh, everything's great, everything's just fine. You know, the economy's collapsing or whatever, but we're going to be just fine. I don't mean it in that way.

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I just mean to say, yes, here is what is happening. Be truthful. But I believe that we will find a way and together when we put all our minds together. And I make it safe for my team to be able to share their input that provides me information that will help me to be able to figure it out. So emotional intelligence involves not only me regulating my nervous system, being aware of myself, but also being aware of you and being.

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Having the social skills to interact with you in a positive way, to have empathy for you, to make it safe so that you feel safe in being able to express yourself and be authentic with who you are. And then it also involves motivation. Am I working to develop myself in the best way possible? Am I a truth seeker? Am I learning?

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Am I striving to improve each day? And those are the core elements of emotional intelligence that I think make for the best leader. I agree. I agree so much. And it's leadership in all areas of leadership and all types.

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I mean, I think about in the business where I work in Silicon Valley in a tech company. I think about it in terms of politics. I think about it in terms of peacemaking. I mean, you mentioned Israel, you know, in the Middle east, to have traumatized people like the Jewish people, like the Palestinian people, all people trying to come to the table with leaders that aren't always so great and try to create psychological safety for people to say, hey, here's my opinion. It's really different from yours to be able to say, you know, I'm going to regulate my emotions.

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Because maybe what you said isn't my opinion, but leaders know how to be challenged. I don't know about you, but, like, I want people in my life to challenge me as a leader, but I want to challenge others, and I want them to challenge me in a way that's emotionally intelligent, that cares for me. But the. That the posture of the challenge is, I care about you as a person. I realize what I have to say might be hard to hear, but friends and leaders who care can have that type of emotional intelligence where it says, here's a part of your life that you may not see, and I care for you enough to.

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I don't want you to go down that road like, that decision you're making is really bad or whatever. So emotional intelligence, it's work. It's a skill. Some people seem to be born with it, but others of us have to work harder at it. So why do you think it's important for leaders to be able to regulate their nervous system?

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Well, you just brought up one of the most classic examples. So if you and I are on polar opposites, politically or economically or in whatever way, if you have a polar opposite of view about something, a decision that we are trying to make, but we are coming together, trying to find a way to work together, or maybe you are coming to the table wanting to convince me of your way and you want me to change the way that I'm doing things to come to your way of doing or being or thinking. What happens is that the two people come together and one person may have a very strong opinion, and the other person may feel triggered by that, and it may cause a reaction within me. I may feel some resistance. I may push back a little bit, even physically, you know, you'll see.

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You watch people move back. And being aware of those things helps me. If I have enough knowledge to know what is going on, I'll say, oh, I see how they're moving away. They feel less comfortable, they're coming closer. That means that they want to engage more.

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Something as simple as that makes a big difference. But if I'm the one who is triggered and I have emotional intelligence skills that I have learned, I can take a deep breath, I can say it's okay, and I can be curious, and I can step away for a moment and not allow my dysregulated nervous system to dysregulate further so that I am not able to have that communication. Because if I can say, if I can remember that I care about you as a human and I want to understand you, you feel that from me. And let's say that you even feel agitated with me. Let's say that you.

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You feel upset with me in some way. If I can convey to you that I care about you, you and that I want to understand you first before I want to be understood. Which reminds me of my favorite quote by Stephen R. Covey. He said, and I learned this in college, which made all the difference for me.

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But he said, seek first to understand and then to be understood. And when I apply that very emotionally intelligent skill in my relationships and you are, say, agitated or escalated, but you feel that I want to understand you, automatically you start to de. Escalate. If I just say, tell me more. Help me understand where you're coming from with a true authentic concern for you.

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And you feel it, you start to relax. It may not 100%, but you start. And the more I want to hear, the more I want to listen and care and show you that I care by understanding, the more that you realize we're both humans and we have common humanity together. And then that's when we make progress. So that's extremely important as a leader, especially when emotions are escalated.

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Oh, 100%. No, absolutely. I always loved Stephen Covey. My first job out of grad school, I moved from here in the Bay Area to Indonesia. And I worked.

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And my boss at the time was big on the seven habits. And so I ended up getting certified. Certified for the 7 Habits of Franklin Covey. And I felt like the seek first to understand them, be understood, is a game changer. But it's.

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It really requires a mindset shift because, you know, in my 20s, I was still young, and this is my first job out of grad school. And so you're trying to, you know, learn and you're curious and you're, you know, I'm a very adventurous person and an extrovert. So seeking for us to understand, it took a lot of intentionality, but it does become, over time, something that just feels more natural, even though it's always, I think, a bit of hard work. But it certainly helped me as a podcast host and it's helped me as a leader. And those principles are certainly emotional intelligence skills that we can learn in the world.

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Needs a lot more more of. Today, I actually trained globally on a course called Listen to Understand. It's my most basic course in my key leadership program where we teach, you know, I mean, I'm training executives, I'm training our engineers, all kinds of leaders, globally on just listening for facts, feelings and values, trying to suspend judgment. These are actually really hard things to do that I myself am still working on. But I think that what you're mentioning is how we show up in the room as leaders.

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Are we a non anxious presence? Are we open or are we closed? It makes all the difference. I would love to hear from you because I know you are the queen of empathy. And so why do you think empathy is such a powerful tool as a leader?

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You know, when you were talking about these skills and listening, you know, what are we listening for? A lot of times people are listening and their first thought as they're listening is to rebut. What can I say next? How can I rebut that comment that was made? But when I listen, truly to understand and I really care about you, I Listen in a different way.

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I listen for meaning and not my meaning, but your meaning. What is your meaning? So empathy is vital for this because I try to look at it from your point of view. If I don't understand your point of view and even if I think I understand your point of view, I need to clarify, I need to ask those non threatening questions. Help me understand you.

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Tell me more. I really want to know. I'm curious about this. Those are the kind of phrases that help someone not feel interrogated. A lot of times when we ask questions, people have past experiences that cause them to feel interrogated even when we have the best of intentions.

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So we do need to be very careful and sometimes we have to preface it by saying some. And I teach, I teach leaders this very skill to say, I'm just curious. Could you help me understand this? I want to know more. I don't feel like I really have enough information.

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Could you help me? And those kind of ways of approaching, wanting to gain that understanding and trying to ask those questions help the communicator to be able to feel more safe, to be authentic in what they share. Because if you feel like someone is going to attack you when you're sharing, you don't share in the same way. And so it's very vital. And just like you, I teach leaders these skills because no matter where we are at in the spectrum, we can always be better.

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And even being reminded, if I hear it from your point of view, when you've been working in your circles, light bulbs go off for me. And I'm not only gaining insight from you and from the people that you've worked with, I'm also remembering the things that I've learned in the past. And so we all of us know so much more than we actually do. So we all need to be reminded of the things that we've even learned in the past. It's very helpful.

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I agree. This is how we get better together by sharing our perspectives with each other. I just think you can be, I talk about this sometimes and I train our leaders at the company where I work here in Silicon Valley because we have some pretty smart people. Like, I don't have a clue about some of the, you know, most of the engineering stuff. I mean, I'm raising an engineer, he's in college.

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But I mean, just because he's learning it doesn't mean I know it. There's always so much to learn. You could be a total genius in one area, but nobody knows everything about everything. And isn't that the beauty that we have communication and can learn, and the ways that, you know, we can listen, hear each other's perspectives, and it could actually help us innovate and rethink some of the ways we live and work. So I think I.

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What I love about what you're saying is, you know, you're talking about a leader who needs to work on themselves with the self leadership of self regulation, of doing that hard work, whether it's going to therapy, you know, learning tools, reading books, listening to podcasts like this, or all of the above. And then you also have a person who might question that leader who needs to, you know, suspend judgment as they're speaking, but also suspend judgment as they're listening. These are. This is, like, I think one of the hardest skills we have. It's really hard in our day and age.

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And so, like, there's two. There's two responsibilities there. There's the job of the leader to say, you know, if that person asks a question, they don't ask it perfectly. You know, take a deep breath. They're not out to get you.

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It's okay. And then also, if you're asking the question, you know, try your best to ask it in a way, just talking about basic communication skills. I'm wondering, like, in your experience as a leader, if you had people that modeled that well for you or maybe you had somebody that didn't and you want to share a little bit of a story about why this is so important to you based on your own personal experiences with people. Yes, I've had both. The best person that role modeled this for me was my father.

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He's a psychologist and naturally empathetic. He was just so empathetic. And. And he had this incredible ability to discern people's thoughts. I thought as a child that he had ESP because he could tell things before people even opened their mouth.

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He just had them. Yeah. And. And strangers. He would tell us things about strangers before they ever shared anything.

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We would meet people in different places, and he would say, this is going on with them. And. And then they'd tell us. And. And my mom would say, how did you know that?

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And I was always curious. I did wonder that. But the other thing that he did was he listened so well. He loved to hear people's stories, and he loved to tell stories. So I loved to.

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I learned to listen by him sharing stories, but I also learned by listening to him listen to other people as I watched him, you know, ask insightful questions and just really care about people. So that was the basis of where I started. My mother, she is also one of these kind of people that people say, she's never met a stranger and she loves people. And I also gained that from her. People when they meet her, they say, oh, I see where you got it from.

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And so those two, my mom and dad were both very good examples of that. I also had some poor examples. I have worked. You and I were talking earlier. I have worked with some toxic bosses that were.

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I mean, I had some. Some massive trauma at work and in the workplace. And I learned so much about the non example, about how not to communicate and how not to threaten people and how not to cause fear with people because I saw them do that. And I also learned to stand up to bullies because of that, which was a very powerful thing for me because I just don't like dealing with bullies. But sometimes it's needful and I did have to learn that skill.

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So emotional intelligence comes into play in all of those. It absolutely does. Thank you for sharing that. It is me coming out with my story of a workplace bully has been. It was scary to do that.

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Obviously it was scary to talk about. I didn't want to talk about it because I just wanted to never even happen in the first place. Right. But I think the surprise for me was how many people it connected me with who were like, me too. I mean, it's the power of Me too, right, where there's so many people who have these experiences and are in therapy for years or they have to switch industries, they have to do whole career pivots based on it.

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I mean, it's men and women, but it's been a lot of women because the power dynamics between men and women already. And then some men, they've had childhood experiences that, you know, adverse childhood experiences or traumatic childhoods. And then they have been kind of, you know, they don't want to go to therapy or they go to therapists that they just kind of mess around. They don't really do anything to actually look inside and heal. And then they use anger to control.

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I just think it's pretty common in the stories that I hear. And so you talked about learning some lessons from that. And I would love to know if somebody here is listening and they're experiencing a workplace bullying situation, a toxic boss mobbing, any of those things. What are some. What's some advice that you would give them based on what you learned?

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So the first thing that I learned was I did go to the person and communicate with them about how I Felt I communicated, you know, not, you did this thing wrong, but I communicated with how I felt when the situation was happening. I believed that they were coming from a place of escalated emotions in their situation. Some people were afraid. I've had more than one bully. I've had men that were bosses that were bullies.

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I've had women that were bosses that were bullies. And so I first tried speaking about the situation from a feeling standpoint. And that is the most effective way. But even in those situations, it's not always the solution. So I had to take additional measures, and I had to document.

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I had to have continuing conversations. I had to bring in other people to help with those conversations. And sometimes there were. There were legal matters that were involved. So it.

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It became a very challenging situation for me. But in every single one of those situations, I prayed a lot. And I relied on the Lord to guide me and to give me the words and to help me to know when to say things, when not to say things, how to say it, and. And he prevailed with miracles. And I was able to come to resolution in a peaceful way.

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And I was so thankful it didn't end up going to court, but I did have to have a lawyer involved. But it didn't get to a threatening kind of a situation. But they did do an investigation, and the situation was resolved. Then I needed to work with someone who viewed me as an adversary, which was challenging because I needed to repair. And there was fear.

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There was still fear involved. And yet we were able to do it. We were able to come together. But it took a lot of empathy on my part to see them as a human that was interacting with me based on false information that they had about me, and to also forgive, to realize that they were just having a huge misunderstanding about things at the moment. And we were able to work together.

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And I worked for many, many years after that with intention in several different situations. So I think that it's helpful to know that there is hope, that you don't have to just take it and you don't have to be bullied. That you can use emotional intelligence within yourself and you can also help others to learn emotional intelligence and you can move forward in a synergistic way. Well, that was the thing that was the advice that I would give people to know that there is definitely is hope. That's so encouraging.

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Yeah. I think that I'm so grateful for lawyers, like employment lawyers. We. I feel like California is such a great state for that. I know everywhere is different.

00:23:40
And then people around the world have different things around what employment law looks like in your country. But I think that if you're what. What I'm taking from what you're saying is that wherever people live in the world, maybe investigate your own employment laws and see if there have been some laws broken. Because like you said, you don't have to walk through this alone. And then also, you know, some people are just, that's based on false information.

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Maybe there was somebody who told somebody something about you that wasn't true or they made an assumption that was wrong. We're human, we can all do that. And so in situations like that where it sounds like your skills came into play with the help that you had and the support that you had. And so I think there is so much hope in that and I hope that people feel encouraged by that. And I would also add a disclaimer that if it's a narcissist that's bullying you, those rules don't apply because I just find that that's a whole different ball game and they tend to not ever come around.

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But any. Go ahead. What were you going to say? I was going to say I have dealt with narcissists also. Okay.

00:24:35
Yeah, it's been very challenging. Miraculously, it did come around. I mean, honestly, it was the biggest miracle in the world. But I also have to say that I also had some very strategic, powerful. I had a very powerful woman and I had a very powerful man that advocated for me.

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The woman with the woman and the man with the man. And so those were massive miracles because of those two people that advocated for me, that helped them to see the truth about me. That's why, you know, things change. So I think it's amazing because a lot of times we don't know how powerful an advocate can be, but men can make a huge difference for women in leadership, especially in a male dominated world, which I was in a male dominated world. And I had men that support, supported me and loved me and cared for me and appreciated me and saw my value and they were an advocate for me.

00:25:33
So I just want to give a shout out to men like that who respect women, who value women. I'm working with Ashkan Tabibnia right now with 90210 Enterprises. He is an amazing advocate for women. And I want to give a shout out to him, to Mo Rock, who is the CEO for Los Angeles Tribune. He loves women and supports women.

00:25:52
And I just appreciate both of them specifically because I'm working so closely with them right now. It makes Such a difference, doesn't it? I mean, there's a different. There's different types of power. There's the power over the power with.

00:26:04
There's a couple other kinds. But I think when people don't understand power dynamics in a workplace and they don't understand the power dynamics between men and women in most societies, unless you're blessed to be in a matrilineal society, and I've been in some of those, and they're amazing. And there's a couple in Asia, one in Sumatra where I. Near where I work. But most cultures of the world are facing, you know, a patriarchal system.

00:26:24
And so to not acknowledge the power dynamics there. But for men to use their power to not power over to power with sponsor women, to champion women, to support women, to speak to a man that won't listen to women or at least doesn't do a good job of listening or being curious about being wrong about them, then it's huge. I've had men like that in my life, too. A shout out to all of them that are listening. It really does make a difference.

00:26:46
I think if there's a way in this podcast for making a difference. If the one takeaway you have is just to support women who are being bullied, especially if you're a man and you can stand up for her, like, that would just be huge, really impactful, and each other. I love how you are a woman who supports women because that's not very common either, to have women that empower other women. And so thank you for what you are doing, Lori, because you're a beautiful example of that and the way that you train leaders. I know that that's an element that you model in your own life.

00:27:16
And even if you don't say the words, I watch what you do, I see you in action, and I just want to applaud you for being a woman who empowers other women. That means a lot to me. Thank you for saying that. I will say that I am paying it forward, having been blessed by a lot of women who have supported me throughout my life and career and across the world. And then currently as well, I get the honor of sitting on a couple of boards that are all women.

00:27:42
And it's just an amazing thing. But at the same time, like you, I've had women who were the ones that were maybe not necessarily bullying at work, but the. The roadblock to women's careers, ones telling women to be small or making it harder for them or those kinds of things. And so I just think That I have a bachelor's in sociology, so I understand some of the social dynamics that go on. When you have a majority people, whether it's economically, where it's a class system or it's racial or gender or based on citizenship or those pursuing citizenship, there's a lot of.

00:28:16
You could break it up a lot of different ways. You know, maybe parts of the country people live in, whatever country it is, but when you think about systems where the majority owns the power and they want those who are not in the majority to not gain the power, I mean, one of the oldest tricks in the book is divide and conquer. And so sometimes women have fallen into that system that basically says to go against each other because that's the dynamics that have been. It's not one person that did this. This is something we've all been born into and narratives we pick up even subtly sometimes.

00:28:50
And so I think that when you think of a scarcity mentality where there's only one seat on that board or there's only one job at that company, or there's only one opportunity for me, then the scarcity mentality of a dominant culture against a culture that's a more minority will make people, male versus female, in this example, think that, oh, we have to go against each other and compete instead of support. And my whole thing is with the world of difference is that there's abundance, there's always room for more. I'm creating a table here for more perspectives. I don't want less, I want more. I'm kind of greedy like that.

00:29:23
I just want all the perspectives because I think we get better that way. And so I think that that's why sometimes women have competed against each other. But I honestly say, in my experience, maybe I've just been very privileged. But I look at the examples of so many women who are supporting each other. And in my personal lived experience, I think there's more women who support each other than those who don't.

00:29:44
And especially when we can frame it like this, like we're on the same team. Right. There's power in us together. Yes. And I want to give a shout out to Mary Glorfield also.

00:29:56
She's a woman who has mentored me at the Los Angeles Tribune. She was the executive vice president for Tony. Tony Robbins for 18 years. Now she leads at the Los Angeles Tribune and at the Women's Journal there. I'm the executive director of the Women's Journal.

00:30:10
We have a community of women who are publishing their stories and speaking and so abundant minded. I Just love how we support each other when we're speaking and cheer for each other when we're on podcasts. And it's a beautiful energy. And Mary sets that tone. And I'm so grateful for Mary and the way that she empowers women to be able to achieve their potential, to be able to shine and to have vis.

00:30:34
So she's much like you. Thank you, Mary. You're doing a great job. And when we met at the podcast conference in LA last year, I don't know if we talked about this. I feel like I say this a lot, but I don't know if we've talked about it before, but when I first started podcasting, I was told in LA at that same conference, you know, years prior, where I was speaking as well, somebody told me only 15% of podcasts in the US are hosted by women, so 85% men.

00:30:58
I don't know if the stats have changed recently, but then I met somebody who is a podcaster and, you know, part of a, like, podcast software service or whatever from the France, and she was a woman at one of the conferences where I spoke, and she said, it's actually opposite In France, it's 85% women. And I thought, wow, isn't that interesting? So I have a lot of curiosity about why that's true. But all that to say, even in podcasting, I found women to be very supportive of each other, being on each other's podcasts, introducing us to men that they know, like, all of it is just a very supportive community. So shout out to every single woman and man who's a podcaster who has helped me and given me advice, even when I was like, I don't know if I want to do that.

00:31:39
You know, it's helpful because we need more of each other's perspectives. And I, I definitely think we weren't women in podcasting. So I'm grateful for what you do in your whole network. Also, with women podcasters, if somebody's listening and they are a woman podcaster or they know one, what is some, you know, advice or ways you could share with them about your journey as a podcast host and how to, like, help each other do more podcasting? Yes.

00:32:03
I, you know, that that statistic is one of the things that motivated Mo Rock to establish the Los Angeles Tribune Podcast Network with Michael Silvers. It was to give more stages to women. Mo said, I want to flip that narrative. Where are all the women in the personal development? I want them to speak more, I want them to have more podcasts.

00:32:21
And so as, as a woman podcaster, I am very grateful for when there is a collaborative feeling between each other. And I know you and I have done the same thing. You know, we want to support each other with our podcast, but one of the things that we can do to support each other is ask, how can I support you? I love it when someone asks me this question. If I'm having a special guest, if you're my guest and I would like people to increase my visibility on social media, would you please support me and tag me and share this message or be a collaborator with me on social media or, or be a guest.

00:32:52
And then if I can say, do you know any other guests that I could have that you think would be aligned in emotional intelligence and leadership? I would love to have them be on my podcast. I have a second podcast, the Empathy Advantage. I have the Hero within podcast, and I have a comedy podcast called Unstoppable af. Unstoppable and funny.

00:33:11
I love it. We can help each other. And sometimes when I find a person, I'll be like, that reminds me of that podcast. I should tell that podcaster about this guest and connect the two. The world is, you know, a big place and I don't know everyone in your network.

00:33:28
And so when you share your resources or a conference that you're speaking at, you recently, you know, told me about your leadership opportunities that you were speaking at and invited me to be a part of your network. I was so grateful that you did that, and I like to do that with people, too. And so when we have that abundant mindset, we are willing to share with people and to invite them in for a place at the table, because the table is big enough for all of us. It absolutely is. I grew up in South America and our transportation is the same.

00:33:58
You can see buses and it's like, can they fit another person on there? And somehow they do. So there is always room for one more. That's what my life taught me growing up there. But I love what you're doing.

00:34:07
It's so exciting. It's so joyful. It's so wonderful and refreshing. We need leaders who care. And kindness is such a much needed leadership skill.

00:34:17
And I'm working on it in leadership development, and it's refreshing. Leadership is changing. The old way is not going to last much longer because there's more of us than there are of them. And so really excited about what you're doing and to support you in this way. How can people find you and all of your podcasts and all of your speaking and all that you're doing to find out more.

00:34:37
The best way to find me is on LinkedIn. If you're interested in sharing your story with the Los Angeles Tribune at a speaking event, we have. Our upcoming event is March 22, the global women's Leadership Symposium, sponsored by the Los Angeles Tribune and the Women's Journal. We also have a Spanish journal that I'm the executive director on. So I know you have people for me there, but you can always find me on LinkedIn and connect with me there.

00:34:59
And I would love to hear you and hear your story. That's awesome. Thank you so much, Karen Hall, queen of Empathy, for being on today. I'm gonna have you stick around. We'll be on our with our difference makers on Patreon and ask you one other question there.

00:35:13
That's an exclusive episode for all you difference makers with us in the Patreon community. But it has been so wonderful to talk to you today. I wish you all the best. Keep spreading all of that empathy everywhere you go. Thank you.

00:35:25
And thank you for the world of difference that you make. By all of your love and compassion and your support and your leadership training, you are making a world of difference. And I appreciate you, Lori. Thanks, Karen. Wow, what a conversation.

00:35:39
Isn't she just the best? I mean, when I met her, we had such a connection in la and Karen Hall, she just gave us a masterclass in dealing and leading with empathy. And if you think there's one thing that you want to take away from today, let's let it be this. Listen first to understand that Stephen Covey principle that she talked about. Seek first to understand and then be understood.

00:36:01
Not to respond, not to fix it, but to truly hear the people around you. This is how trust is built. This is how real leadership happens. And let's talk about the raw truth that Karen Hall shared. Being bullied by toxic bosses, more than one.

00:36:19
Standing up for herself, taking legal action. It's no small thing, is it? It's terrifying. It's exhausting. It wrecks you.

00:36:26
And it's something too many people go through in silence. But Karen did not stay silent. Brava to you, Karen. And she turned her pain into power. And now she's helping others to do the same.

00:36:37
That's what real courage looks like. No wonder she loves Queen Esther. No wonder that inspires her. Because she's following in the footsteps of somebody who did the right thing at the right time, the hard thing, stood up, spoke truth to power, even her own bully to try to be Empathetic and patch things up. That is real leadership.

00:36:56
And once again, disclaimer. If you're in a situation with a narcissist, rules don't apply. Please care for yourself, seek safety, seek refuge, and if all possible, come with an escape plan, help people, help you. She obviously helped people standing up for her and helping her, and so the circumstances were different. But if you find yourself in a situation where you're not psychologically safe, please gather support around you for people who will believe you, that know you and love you and care for you.

00:37:21
Build a tribe around yourself if you don't have one, and make an escape plan to get out. Because you don't need to be in an environment where you're constantly broken down on a daily basis. It will affect you in every possible way with your health and your mental health and your physical health and your spiritual and relational health and financial health, all of it will be affected. And I know that Matt may be hard to hear right now, but from my own lived experience and from the experiences of many, many stories of others, I hope that you find a way to get to safety and come up with an escape plan. But here's your challenge.

00:37:49
As you're out there in the world in all kinds of situations, whether you're starting something as an entrepreneur, whether you're in a career pivot, whether you're an individual contributor in your company and you're wanting to grow in your leadership, here's your challenge. Start listening. Start showing up with empathy. And if you're in a toxic situation, know this. You are not alone.

00:38:10
You have options. You're not stuck, and you are stronger than you think. If this episode hit home for you, please share it with five people who need to hear it. Think of those in your life that are dealing with something. They're feeling stuck.

00:38:23
Maybe they're dealing with a toxic boss. Maybe somebody who needs to learn a little empathy and learn to listen more. Maybe somebody who also loves Queen Esther, maybe somebody who lives in the LA area. Think of all the people in your life that this episode could make a difference for. Because Karen Hall is the kind of person that is an authentic leader.

00:38:40
She's out there trying to do her best to listen well and be an empathetic leader in all of her spheres. And so I want her voice to be able to make a difference in the lives of those that you also care about. Your loved ones, your family, your friends. So think of five people, send this episode to them, and as always, keep making a difference. You've got this and I will see you in the next episode.

00:39:01
Before we go, I just want to take a moment to thank you. Yes, you. The fact that you're here, tuning in, leaning into these conversations, and doing the hard and beautiful work of making a difference in this world, it means everything to me in this episode. If it spoke to you, if it brought you healing, hope, or even just a new perspective, I'd love for you to help us spread the word. Subscribe to the podcast, leave us a review, and share this episode with someone you think might need to hear it.

00:39:34
Your support helps this community grow and also helps us to keep having these important conversations. You are such a vital part of this journey, and every time you listen, every time you share, you remind me of why we do this. Because you are out there making a difference in your own beautiful, messy, and imperfect way. And that that matters more than you know. So thank you for being here, thank you for showing up, and thank you for making the world a little brighter, a little kinder, and a little more whole.

00:40:06
Until next time, take care of yourself and keep making a difference. You are loved.